WA Resolution: A Ban on Forced Disappearances

[Hockeynutville]

A Ban on Forced Disappearances
A resolution to increase democratic freedoms.

Category: Furtherment of Democracy
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: Unibotian WA Mission


Description: The General Assembly,

Appalled by governments that resort to enforcing disappearances, most commonly to deny individuals of their existing civil and political rights,

Defines a Forced Disappearance as a political tactic, where a government or government sponsored entity conceals the fate, or existence of an individual or a group of individuals who were required by said government to vanish from public view,

Hereby Solemnly:

1. Prohibits member nations, and the World Assembly from forcing the disappearance of any individual;

2. Requires the reversal of the political tactics used against victims of forced disappearance by …
(a) Releasing to the public all of the government documentation surrounding these cases of forced disappearances;
(b) Publicizing the whereabouts of these individuals, or the circumstances of their death;

3. Demands that there be no statute of limitation on forced disappearance;

4. Permits member states to protect the identities and whereabouts of an individual in a way that may bear characteristics of forced disappearances, provided that the intentions of this resolution are respected and that the said individual has given consent;

5. Declares that any organization of a member nation which utilizes the provisions of Clause 4 must be officially publicized to said member nation at least to the extent of the general purpose of the program or bureaucratic entity being publicly documented;

6. Requests that such public documentation must also include that the organization is utilizing Clause 4 of this document;

7. Welcoming the addition of further legislation on the subject by member states, such as providing reparations to victims of forced disappearances, or their families.

[Anime Daisuki]

This resolution impinges upon the right of Dictatorships and Father-know-best states to rule their own nation. It also goes against the Constitution of our region.

5. The following are recognized as the inalienable rights of the member nations of the 10000 Islands.

5.1. Self-determination. The general government of the 10000 Islands shall make no law or regulation governing the internal operation of any nation state within the region. Each nation state will maintain the right to govern itself in accordance with its own customs and desires.

Personally I am not for 'forced disappearances', but I would never force my beliefs on others, as I would not want others to force their beliefs on my nation.

AGAINST.

[Twobagger]

Voted for, since I believe that the lives of citizens come before a government's "right" to be able to abduct or assassinate their own citizens.

[Bad Infinitum]

I love forced disappearances. Sometimes you just gotta get shit done, and that's the quickest and cleanest way.

Also, the constitution thing.

Against.

[Anime Daisuki]

Mar 17, 2010 16:16:16 GMT -5 Bad Infinitum said:

Also, the constitution thing.

Against.

Excellent! Our forefathers (ahem Parthini) would be glad.

[Twobagger]

Mar 17, 2010 18:11:36 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

Unlike Twobagger, I fully support our Constitution.

Your argument that governments should be able to commit acts of terrorism willy-nilly against their own citizens.
So, unlike Anime Daisuki, I am against terrorism.

[Bad Infinitum]

Eh, NationStates is full of psychotic dictators and malevolent leadership. It's not our place to judge how other nations conduct business inside their own borders. The XKI Constitution supports that, and I support the XKI Constitution.

[Twobagger]

I thought the point of the World Assembly was to judge how other nations conduct business inside their own borders. It makes laws and guidelines that all member states must follow. You could argue that just about any of their resolutions violate our Constitution... but that would put us into Gatesville territory, wouldn't it?

[Anime Daisuki]

Mar 17, 2010 18:21:57 GMT -5 Twobagger said:

Mar 17, 2010 18:11:36 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

Unlike Twobagger, I fully support our Constitution.

Your argument that governments should be able to commit acts of terrorism willy-nilly against their own citizens.
So, unlike Anime Daisuki, I am against terrorism.

I'm only supporting our Constitution clause 5.1 for national self-determination. Are you suggesting our Constitution supports terrorism?

[Twobagger]

Mar 17, 2010 18:33:43 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

I'm only supporting our Constitution clause 5.1 for national self-determination. Are you suggesting our Constitution supports terrorism?

I'm suggesting that you are using our Constitution as a justification for terrorism, and that this is fundamentally immoral since our Constitution was written to promote peace, justice and security.

[Anime Daisuki]

How I or someone else wants to rule our nation is our business. There are TITO members here who have nations that are Communists or Dictatorships, with little or zero Civil Rights and Political Rights. You accuse all of these nations, whose form of government allows 'forced disappearances', support terrorism.

The region accepts all forms of nations, not just New York Times Democracy. I like you to remember that if you want to be a Senator representing ALL nations.

[Twobagger]

Mar 17, 2010 18:44:02 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

How I or someone else wants to rule our nation is our business. There are TITO members here who have nations that are Communists or Dictatorships, with little or zero Civil Rights and Political Rights. You accuse all of these nations, whose form of government allows 'forced disappearances', support terrorism.

Why, yes, I do accuse nations who murder and abduct their own citizens on a whim of supporting terrorism, because they are committing acts of terror against their own citizens.

Do you also support the right of member nations in our region to form invader armies? After all, how you or someone else wants to rule their nation is none of our business, right?

[Twobagger]

Actually, you know what? I'm tired of this argument.
AD, if you'll just copy and paste this following statement, I will retract my vote and switch it to NO.

I, Anime Daisuki, have never voted FOR any United Nations or World Assembly General Assembly resolution with the exception of repeals to existing resolutions. This is because every single resolution passed limits our member nations' rights. I also have voted FOR every single repeal of UN or WA General Assembly resolutions, because those resolutions unfairly limit our member nation's rights.

[Bad Infinitum]

Now, I usually stay out of WA discussions, because I see the WA as nothing more than a weapon in the ongoing defender/raider wars. However, we're bordering on the fringe of a debate of right vs. wrong.

Forced disappearances, AKA "black bag" operations, are used to remove bad people from an otherwise good society. They're tools in the fight against terrorism. It's the government's form of throwing out a bad egg, or culling a lame sheep from the flock. The fact of the matter is, persons removed from society via black bag operations are criminals, and are usually tried and convicted just like other criminals, it's just done under the radar for fear of a backlash from the press or the person gaining notoriety amongst the public. Sometimes the person is tried and convicted without being present, despite being asked to attend, and if the sentence is execution then the sentence is carried out.

Though it seems shady to the public eye, this is a perfectly legitimate method of exacting justice on wrongdoers. Corrupt governments will abuse it, benevolent leaders will embrace it justly, and those that choose to avoid the practice inevitably have terrorists walking the streets, the general populace none the wiser. If the WA outlaws forced disappearances, they might as well start declaring all-out war on all nations that are Corrupt Dictatorships or Communists. Hell, even a simple kidnapping in an Anarchy could technically be considered a forced disappearance.

A better resolution would call for the ban of unjust forced disappearances. Regulation and control, rather than outright prohibition. I would support that resolution.

[Anime Daisuki]

@twobag

You are mixing up in character with out-of-character.

IC, national leaders have a right to rule their nations however they wish, they can be communist, democratic, or dictator. It is none of your business. The Constitution protects the right to self-determination. I support that.

In game/out of character, TITO does not support Nazism or invaderism.

[Twobagger]

Mar 17, 2010 19:08:18 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

@twobag

You are mixing up in character with out-of-character.

IC, national leaders have a right to rule their nations however they wish, they can be communist, democratic, or dictator. It is none of your business. The Constitution protects the right to self-determination. I support that.

In game/out of character, TITO does not support Nazism or invaderism.

So why don't nations, using the self-determination principle, have a right to decide that they would like to be Nazis?

Edit: as an aside, that clause the Constitution doesn't seem to distinguish between in-character and out-of-character actions, so I'm not sure why the distinction is used to protect one activity and bar another.

[Bad Infinitum]

Because Nazis contradict self determination. They promote their own determination on others.

[Twobagger]

Mar 17, 2010 19:17:59 GMT -5 Bad Infinitum said:

Because Nazis contradict self determination. They promote their own determination on others.

But the argument seems to be that this is okay for a government to do, as long as they do it only to their own citizens.

[Bad Infinitum]

Correct. The real life United Nations doesn't micromanage, neither should the fake-life World Assembly.

[Anime Daisuki]

Mar 17, 2010 19:11:48 GMT -5 Twobagger said:

Mar 17, 2010 19:08:18 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

@twobag

You are mixing up in character with out-of-character.

IC, national leaders have a right to rule their nations however they wish, they can be communist, democratic, or dictator. It is none of your business. The Constitution protects the right to self-determination. I support that.

In game/out of character, TITO does not support Nazism or invaderism.

So why don't nations, using the self-determination principle, have a right to decide that they would like to be Nazis?

Edit: as an aside, that clause the Constitution doesn't seem to distinguish between in-character and out-of-character actions, so I'm not sure why the distinction is used to protect one activity and bar another.

What Ad Infinitum said.

[Twobagger]

Mar 17, 2010 19:54:20 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

What Ad Infinitum said.

So, you support a nation's right to promote a Nazi ideology as long as it stays confined within it's own borders?

[Anime Daisuki]

Bugger off, Twobagger. I've said what I had to say on this matter.

If you want to make it a personal fight, I'm on.

[Twobagger]

Okay, I'm done arguing too. For the record, my offer stands:

AD, if you'll just copy and paste this following statement, I will retract my vote and switch it to NO.

I, Anime Daisuki, have never voted FOR any United Nations or World Assembly General Assembly resolution with the exception of repeals to existing resolutions. This is because every single resolution passed limits our member nations' rights. I also have voted FOR every single repeal of UN or WA General Assembly resolutions, because those resolutions unfairly limit our member nation's rights.

[Bad Infinitum]

Actually, I'd quite like to watch this fight.

[Hockeynutville]

Maybe I should switch my vote, looks like there is still a good market on certain disappearances...

[Bad Infinitum]

*zips a black bag over Twobagger's head*

What Senate candidate?

[NunYa Dam Biz]

Wouldnt Mandatory Govt Service in a secure location be alternative?

[Echolilia]

Mar 17, 2010 15:26:34 GMT -5 Anime Daisuki said:

This resolution impinges upon the right of Dictatorships and Father-know-best states to rule their own nation. It also goes against the Constitution of our region.

5. The following are recognized as the inalienable rights of the member nations of the 10000 Islands.

5.1. Self-determination. The general government of the 10000 Islands shall make no law or regulation governing the internal operation of any nation state within the region. Each nation state will maintain the right to govern itself in accordance with its own customs and desires.

Personally I am not for 'forced disappearances', but I would never force my beliefs on others, as I would not want others to force their beliefs on my nation.

AGAINST.

I agree.

[Ananke II]

I've voted for this resolution, but will switch or withdraw my vote if the poll result changes.

[Hockeynutville]

Now that I am freeeeeeeeee! I vote no.